... so that I don't keep occasionally hijacking others' threads with off topic posts.

Hope some are an interesting read to ya'll, and discussion is of course welcome;

I'll start with this one, which I think is probably best posted with the title, link and small excerpt (<-- hoping that's the appropriate way to post articles on other forums);

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"What On Earth Can the Left and Right Compromise?”

http://wethepeopleusa.ning.com/forum/topics/what-on-earth-can-the-l...

excerpt;

Once Conservatives started "compromising" their principles of individual freedom and less government in favor of the Progressive's collective ideology, the end of America's free Republic became preordained

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...personally, I woulda began the progressive era catastrophe before the 16th amendment, which the article begins it at. I'd go back at least to the 14th amendment. But that wasn't a compromise by the R party (which somehow is assumed to have a quantum entanglement with 'conservative') and doesn't fit the article's primary point of how compromise has proven destructive, it was the party's primary mission at the time.

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 Larry, 

I was looking for the chart that shows ALL the agencies formed to create obummercare, but I did find this old poster I made which shows some of it. I think obummer gave each of the people he owed favors by creating high paying jobs for them...

and then we have the BIG Pharma taking an enormous piece of the pie.

yeah, it's amazingly anti-limited government hence anti-American huh.

that's a different point than i was making.. an ideological one vs mine being about the basic natural laws of economics. A very significant one nonetheless.

...it was the plan all along -- Justice Democrats


it's a coup, whether it be legal or not. has been all along.  ..actually it's the predictable conclusive phase of the 100 year coup uniparty has been embracing.

(not intended to be an endorsement of the other major party..  "I hate (fill in the blank)" IS NOT a valid political argument, whether it be Bush, Clinton, obie, Trump, R or D)

"(not intended to be an endorsement of the other major party.. I hate (fill in the blank) IS NOT a valid political argument, whether it be Bush, Clinton, obie, Trump, R or D)"

Yet, imo, the one elected official that I can actually trust his intentions since Reagan is Donald J Trump.  He has truly brought out the true weasels within the "heroes-of-the country" - the good ole GOP.

The lights have been turned on, and phose cockroaches have been running towards the cover of darkness ever since. 

I still recall all the morons were so gung-ho about their republican guard not so many yrs back.  Don't much from them anymore. Seems they're hiding in the dark as well. They sure as hell won't ever admit that they were wrong about their precious GOPers.

check out Kid Rock's patriotic mansion that's for sale. don't know much about the guy other than he was Pam Anderson's buddy for a while, is a proud American and Trump supporter. His house is purty awesome...   wonder if it has been his main domain. Not the typical rock star mansion i'm guessin.  :~}

https://www.foxnews.com/real-estate/kid-rock-detroit-mansion-sellin...

WSJ headline today =

Nearly all mass shooters young men alienated from society, these are the killers in our midst.

https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/mass-shooters-young-men-alienated-k...

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i believe the article is both right and wrong, the young men part is factually right and the alienation part although being correct in fact is wrong due to the assumption made that alienation is the cause of their behavior. As one myself, I contend that choosing to reject the 'must be connected' narrative of today's culture is the mentally healthy alternative for many with 'loner' (individualistic) traits, and not at all the cause of mass shootings.

Once again - I make the point that correctly identifying problems is imperative to solving them. Our now collectivist society wants us to believe it is the loner characteristic that is the problem because it fits a political and cultural agenda. The same is true with blaming the guns, it's aiming at the wrong target, which has zero chance of solving the problem at hand.

These young mass shooters have almost all, or maybe even every single one of them, been prescribed psychotropic drugs - a medication passed out like it is candy, specifically designed to change a person's mental state... with known side effects that lead to extreme behaviors.

just as i holler about the misidentifying of the political 'enemy' as liberals is misidentifying the target, therefor the correct target, progressives, never becomes the target... misidentifying the 'enemy' in these mass shootings also leaves the correct 'enemy' without a target on it's back. The correct target is the psychotropic drugs we hand out like candy, especially to these young men - it starts in school so they'll sit docile in their chairs and not interrupt the class.

Larry, I agree 100%! I think it goes back to some responsibility to the parents and the dr.s, teachers, school counselors, and friends. Someone somewhere is now shaking their heads saying "I should have spoken up". There is always someone who knows something...People have become fearful and worse complacent- no one wants the responsibility. How do we take a nation back to the communities, how do we take a community back into the homes? It used to "take a village"...

Oh yeah, I remember hyperactive kids, my old teachers knew how to handle them, most of them were just bored and kids were full of mischief...My Dad would have handled it real quick!! Now, they just drug them...

Suzie

how do we defeat the rise of 'collectiveism' in our country/culture?? I think by practicing individualism, individually en masse. One firm decision at a time to reject collectiveism being rammed down our/your/my throat. Rejection of theirs and practicing of ours in everyday life.. proudly, consistently and adamantly. ...along with acknowledging the fact that it can't/won't be accomplished solely by the political realm. It's more of a culture thing...

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following up on my misidentifying points =

i haven't read/heard Trump's speech but have seen media's take on it, and it looks to me he's saying exactly the opposite of what needs to be done, IMO...

more focus on mental health in today's language translates to MORE psychotropic drugs being prescribed and red flag laws is blaming the guns. And more Rs are rushing to the cameras to embrace both, not good at all. Still letting stupidity rule and ignoring the actual source of the problem that's supposedly being addressed.     silly humans

and a little more afterthought;

let's consider just those points 1st being what Trump is promising, more psychotropic drugs and red flag laws, and then also consider those drugs are already widely in use, it's a reasonably safe bet by some of us. Red flag laws are about taking personal information government has or has access to to determine whether they should be allowed to own a gun. How safe a bet do you/anybody think it is that being prescribed psychotropic drugs will be in the top tier of Red Flag Law enforcement criteria?  I think that's about as safe a bet as there could be... and that would put a large % of our population's gun ownership rights at government's mercy. Those supposedly harmless happy pills will certainly be turned into a threat to your gun ownership, at the moment such a law takes effect.   ..and the plan their proposing is to - PRESCRIBE EVEN MORE OF THEM.

 Larry,

I agree to a point. I had a nice long reply, however, my own research now confirms, I simply don't know enough about these drugs to discuss them.  https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3076958/  https://www.webmd.com/depression/fears-and-facts-about-antidepressa...

 On a personal note I used to take "mothers little helper" however because I take opioids for pain, the Dr. doesn't allow for anti-anxiety meds- even though anxiety is in my diagnosis. But, my Dr. has to follow protocol  So instead, I have been prescribed Prozac an anti-depressant- I am not depressed- I am mad as hell!! Living in constant pain and being angry cause anxiety. I am the first to admit I have a temper because I see what is happening in my country and my community and I care!!  

There is a huge difference between psychotropic drugs for mental illness and antidepressants. I think most Dr.s have no clue what they are doing messing with peoples brain chemistry. 

Again, no one wants the responsibility for the mentally ill. And throwing more drugs at them is NOT the answer.

I don't like to use this resource- but this is a great timeline https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2013/04/timeline-mental-health...

I don't think red flags or bans will help this situation- I think if we open that door- next they will be at our door. Guns or weapons are not the problems- people are, more specifically mentally ill people.

PS. It is not that I do not see your points, I do realize that it would appear that I do not "get" your points, however sometimes a subject takes me down a different road!

Suzie

i think the most important point you make is; "There is a huge difference between psychotropic drugs for mental illness and antidepressants. I think most Dr.s have no clue what they are doing messing with peoples brain chemistry. "

i think the 1st half is a misconception.. probably nefariously fueled, i dunno. Depression is classified as mental illness and anti-depressants are one of many different sub-categories of psychotropic drugs. I too had a temporary experience with an anti-anxiety pill prescription, which i didn't appreciate anything about - the prescribing of it or the effects. I went to the Dr. with the specific request of muscle relaxers to help release my neck muscles after an anger event - which when locked tight irritated a herniated disk.  Without any discussion or council he decided he'd go after my anger with psychotropics instead.  --once i figured it all out it didn't do my anger issue much good at all. :~}

here's my search results link about anti-depressants being psychotropics - there are lists of them all and their categories at some of the links provided;

https://www.bing.com/search?q=are+antidepressants+a+psychotropic+me...

and maybe equally important is that the 2nd half of your quote is truth.  ..and why the hell would anybody want somebody not having a clue messing with their brains with chemicals - that all have known potential side effects of leading to undesirable extreme behavior??

Larry,

Of course, you are technically correct.  You are very informed. These drugs are all lumped together- just as the word depression is overused and misunderstood. I think what I was trying to say is that most older people are NOT depressed- we are disgusted. I would say the majority of woman I know are NOT seriously clinically depressed, they are pissed off! and are not equipped to deal with it...

 ..and why the hell would anybody want somebody not having a clue messing with their brains with chemicals - that all have known potential side effects of leading to undesirable extreme behavior??

  Unfortunately, the world moves so fast everyone wants an instant miracle rather than to deal with their problems...

I do know the difference between my current depression/anxiety/anger and clinical depression. I had what I call a complete physical, mental and spiritual breakdown in 1989/90 There is no way an antidepressant such as Prozac would have helped me. I thank GOD that I absolutely refused chemical treatment. I instinctively knew that I did not want my brain chemistry messed with.  And my family agreed. Time and support were what I needed. It took me nearly a year to come out of a dark bedroom. But that is what it took to heal my soul. 

I was in an ER recently and the Dr. and I had a discussion about Prozac... he informed me that 500 mg. of Tumeric is equal to a 20 mg Prozac...without the side effects!! I am headed back to natural meds as much as possible...

Just imagine how easy it would be to control the human race if we all lined up for the "Pill" de jour...

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